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Warhammer
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Joined: 12 Aug 2001
Location: Atlantuh, Jawjuh
Posts: 1226

PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2002 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

|eP|^Tyrant.Tx`h00r wrote:
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
im sorry i find this to amusing...a reload script makes u better?? huh


Well if it made you worse, would you use it?

I don't think I have a problem with eP or vice versa, so I'm going to try to make an unbiased statement here. From this thread, it seems to me that eP is less concerned with changing the negative perception of their clan than they are about defending accusations that scripts or hacks make them better. Addressing the latter will not change the former.

Also, there are several eP members who have acted like asses in game and have gotten themselves temporarily banned by separate admins (not me). I don't hear any comments from them in this thread (perhaps an apology would be in order?), and frankly I don't expect to. That might actually change the negative perception people have.

If all you care about is proving your 1337-ness and knowing the ins and outs of cheat detection and scripting, then so be it. To KopiKat:

KopiKat wrote:
First of all, I beg of you, if there is no physical proof of someone cheating, then dont bother them about it.


Sorry Kopi, it really doesn't work this way. These days with cheaters it's next to impossible to catch current TFC hacks except with a demo in spectator mode, most of the cheat detection software is for CounterStrike and is ineffective against TFC. I'll make public what some people may have noticed, I have actually removed the HLGuard cheat detection from TV2. It only caught 5 cheaters since I switched from CSGuard to HLGuard many months ago. For the performance hit, it is not worth it IMO.

As for whether eP cheats or not, I don't think so. I can kill most of them when I play against them (though some do pwn me.) Like it or not, scripts give you an advantage (otherwise you wouldn't use them!)

I think the issue of cheating in leagues is a lot like doping in Olympic sports. We like to think that no one does it, and it's rare that anyone gets caught, but eventually the pressure to succeed will get to the weak ones and they will give in. It's just a matter of whether they get caught when they do. Is it skill, or is it steroids?

War
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My Personal Insanity
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Joined: 03 Mar 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Warhammer -TPF- wrote:

I think the issue of cheating in leagues is a lot like doping in Olympic sports. We like to think that no one does it, and it's rare that anyone gets caught, but eventually the pressure to succeed will get to the weak ones and they will give in. It's just a matter of whether they get caught when they do. Is it skill, or is it steroids?


But TFC ain't the olympics. Why should there be 'pressure to succeed'?
It is, after all, a GAME, and if it's only fun to a person when they are
winning, I'd think that's a good indication that maybe that person needs a
new hobby. I know a league is supposed to be an organized
professional competition, but it's still not a 'profession'. Save your stress
for school/work.
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ToRaK
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very nice post War.

I will agree, we have some attitude problems in eP. We are at fault. Hopefully we can be a little bit more polite or stfu.

However, there is also a problem with "you". When you demean our skill and insinuate that it is because of scripts, h4x, or Godly intervention that we do well we feel insulted. So please, stop.

Let's both try to be a little nicer.

Thanks.
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sSdD
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok, i was goin to keep quiet, and i've been dormant for a while, but i just came in and saw this, now i understand where soem of these bad attitudes from from, can u guys count how many times we've been accused of "h4xin" lately?? really, with all these "scripts" and h4x?? honestly, that is sad, the best comment was "the wanna-be myg0ts", go look around at real h4xers my friend, what some of these people here have it pure skill at the game, h4xers = those who just plain ole stink at everything, really soem of these foul attitudes have come from these accusations u guys have been throwing at us, really, go play in a league match, once u play in those, u get a real taste of what the game is like, that will make u a much better player, playin with the best in the game, changed me

as for the "once they go to eP, they get better", well we practice, we play a lot of great clans, good challenges, and we play at some butt-wh00pin servers, we play at TV still b/c we like the people around here, those who won't whine and get all mad over small things, but lately, i'm honestly suprised why some are still here, go play at DW, TDA, HCA, ect... u will honestly get ur butt kicked, i get/got wh00ped there, those servers r like matches all the time, great skill, that is what makes u better, we encourage playin at those to get better

honestly, this is gettin out of hand, IT IS JUST A GAME, live with it, honestly, it's a game, play it, if u don't like some people's attitudes, just ignore MM1 (the say command), so really people, go cry me a river, build a bridge and get over it, it's a game, my gosh, not life
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sSdD
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PS: change the topic name, that's kinda sad u have to name it that, plus all u ahve to do is a PM, a lil disappointed at that, but i'll be surprised to see how many eP guys u see around here anymore, since we "h4x" and all, haha funny
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FragFailure
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Joined: 12 Aug 2001
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, it is a game. Everyone can check the attitude at the door however.
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Blown
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Joined: 15 Dec 2001
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cg, I see a few of your guys joke quite alot about the haxing, the scripting. If it bothers them so much then why joke and poke fun about it? I use a few scripts, maybe they help (a tiny tiny bit) and yes there are a few, yes FEW ppl that think that scripts = cheating. Hell, I've gone under some stupid names and got accused of cheating and IMO I'm no where near good enough to deserve that. Why not take the cheating accusations as a complement and prove your not? I just laugh it off, who cares?

I will agree you have a couple ppl in your clan that when I see them online I would leave. They are total azzes and I guess skill is more important to your clan than being respectful to other players. One in particular was a total dick to me and I dont think I've ever done anything to him or for that matter most anyone here to deserve that. I know I've pushed buttons on a few ppl, but I still think they are good ppl. (Bada, Lin and a few others).

Only thing I guess I'd say is your troublemaker clansmates should find somewhere else to play. Do they come to TV just so they can start up a bunch of BS. Is that what you want your eP clan to stand for? We, {db} had a member that acted in that way, and we gave him a choice, cut the crap of he is gone. BTW, I shouldnt HAVE to mute one of your clansmates. Personally if I were an admin he would be banned, especially for his BS comments. If its just a game, that is SUPPOSED to be fun, then why does YOUR clanmates have to come here and be ASSES?
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bobins
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Joined: 09 May 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well i read the first few posts of this then stoped... cos is pathetic.. all this damn arguin

n i've finnaly come to the conclusion that.....

the ville i got addicted to has definatly gone

when i found this place everyone at the time was gettin along.... there wasent any team stackin... everyone was here havin a laugh... etc... bein kind ta n00bs like i was at the time. but is all different now well i get the impresion that it is. some of you may not be able to c it. but the ville to me just isnt the same no more. *sighs*

if you cant c it then... *shrugs* but ive noticed it... and i dont like what im seein (i wanted the ville to stay the nice friendly, fun place to play that i got addicted to).. and i know of a few others that have noticed it aswell....
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EagleEyes
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Joined: 30 Nov 2001
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hum, when did I start hacking? Oh and I play under the alias pewp. So don't think I don't come around anymore. But yeah, no one in our clan cheats. And Blown, I agree with most of what you said, except for we have to prove to the person that's accusing us of cheating that we aren't. If they accuse us, they should prove that we are. Or else, stfu and play, I think accusing someone of cheating is the same as cursing at them, or breaking rule 1. If you honestly think someone is cheating, go get an admin, or take a demo, don't bitch and moan, and waste your and our time. Thanks.
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Typh00n
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No point in fighting over a video game. And anywayz I used be be in eP and as far i saw no one cheated. so quit acting like m0r0ns #Beer
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Violent Pacifist
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bobins wrote:
well i read the first few posts of this then stoped... cos is pathetic.. all this damn arguin

n i've finnaly come to the conclusion that.....

the ville i got addicted to has definatly gone

when i found this place everyone at the time was gettin along.... there wasent any team stackin... everyone was here havin a laugh... etc... bein kind ta n00bs like i was at the time. but is all different now well i get the impresion that it is. some of you may not be able to c it. but the ville to me just isnt the same no more. *sighs*

if you cant c it then... *shrugs* but ive noticed it... and i dont like what im seein (i wanted the ville to stay the nice friendly, fun place to play that i got addicted to).. and i know of a few others that have noticed it aswell....


Actually bobins, everything you mentioned has been here for quite some time. There has been team stacking here since I joined (more then a year ago). Arguing has occured many times, especially between some people at the ville and some people in eP. Really started getting bad about the time you joined I think.

Just letting you know that these kind of things have been at the ville for a long time, and didn't just happen overnight
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Warhammer
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EagleEyes wrote:
If you honestly think someone is cheating, go get an admin, or take a demo, don't bitch and moan


This is absolutely the right thing to do. If you think someone is cheating, the best thing I recommend is to go in spectator mode and watch the game in first person view from the "cheaters" eyes. Record a demo and send it to your favorite admin if it still looks suspicious.
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PondScum007
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

you need to be an admin to spec
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Blown
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EagleEyes wrote:
hum, when did I start hacking? Oh and I play under the alias pewp. So don't think I don't come around anymore. But yeah, no one in our clan cheats. And Blown, I agree with most of what you said, except for we have to prove to the person that's accusing us of cheating that we aren't. If they accuse us, they should prove that we are. Or else, stfu and play, I think accusing someone of cheating is the same as cursing at them, or breaking rule 1. If you honestly think someone is cheating, go get an admin, or take a demo, don't bitch and moan, and waste your and our time. Thanks.



sorry, that part came across incorrectly EE. What I meant was if an Admin questions you, then prove it. I've never once tried to prove that I wasnt cheating to anyone (regs or noobs). Like I said, if some reg or noob accuses me I just laugh it off and go on. I'm sure with your skill EE you've been in the same boat and I think I know you as a player well enough by now that you look at it the same way.

Warhammer: Like what Pond just said, we cant cause we dont have the access to spec someone and record a demo. Maybe if we could then the accusations wouldnt pop up quite as often in game and upset someone in eP or me or anyone else getting wrongly accused.
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sSdD
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2002 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lol yes, a lot of our eP guys have attitude probs, lol some of em r just always plain ole jackass's all the time, but aren't otehr people??i can name some that r to me, but i won't, lol GET OVER IT, MOVE ON, IT'S A GAME
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