[Chen Kenichi]

Well I just got finished reading this post on planetfortress discussing this new debug thing for TFC. One of the things the debug did was take away underwater fog. Here is what he had to say about that...
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So it's time for the big downside of nemesis, altogether with a big flaming towards his creator:
The ability to disable the underwater fog is a cheat. Period.
I don't care if certain cards don't display the fog on D3D. The question if those people are cheating or not is a different discussion, and it's completely besides the point. The underwater fog is a feature on some maps which has been created on purpose. It was used by the mapmaker in his attempt to create an obstacle of sorts. Removing the underwater fog altogether means to tamper with the basic design of the map. And it serves as an unfair advantage to those making use of it. Some people fail to understand why clear water constitutes as an unfair advantage over somebody with underwater fog. But they might think the same about a wallhack. To a certain degree the effect is quite similar: You see something you are not supposed to see. And in some aspect it's even worse than a wallhack because you can already attack the enemy.


And puuhleease don't start with that crap of 'leveling the field' with those people who don't have the fog in D3D. There is no 'leveling the field' when it comes to cheats. There is only a degrading to the same level of the scum using cheats. Again, the problem with fog on D3D is a different - and complicated - matter, and I won't call those people 'cheaters' ... at least not per se. But if you're graphic card DOES display fog on your regular setting and you disable the fog - for example with nemesis - then I call you a cheater.

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I can't remember the last time I have played without the fog. I remember the fog bugging me in the Half-Life single player until I got a new video card. I haven't stopped for a second to think that some people still play with the fog on some maps like Well. So how many of you still DO play with the fog and what do you think about those who don't??

To read the whole post go to http://www.planetfortress.com/fort/
It's discussing the nemesis hook.
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[ToRaK]

A very silly arguement. The author thinks that it is "okay" for the playing field to be unequal (the D3D user seeing me). But then, the same author thinks it is a "cheat" that a non-D3D player to be able to see his attacker. Just doesn't make sense to me.
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The most hated.

[SoDum]

H4x

Actually i don't use nemisis, and probably never will considering when the new Valve anticheat starts actually working client hooks like that will be caught by it. (I still think the speedometer in sparkies would be helpful though.)

As for the underwater fog thing, i honestly don't see why people are complaining about that if they arn't complaining about nemisis as a whole, because by that right you are saying people basically have hardware hacks to remove the fog since most people don't have it. I didn't when i started but the blue boxes from software mode started to bug me. So the time came to use Open GL, and working with the fog was a huge pain because alot of people didn't, and would shoot me all the way from the end of the well tube and i'd have no chance to return fire.

This means the people that have the hardware h4x that lets you see through walls (EAS or whoevers care) are just as bad as people that have the water fog h4x where it isn't displayed. Of course The people that use nemisis and noone else will be blamed because nemisis is a client hook, but, oh well.

I do play with the fog. Normally it's no problem, but the only map that it hurts on hard core is well. And it hurts. Hardcore. I can't use the water passage if someone is guarding that entrance.
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Stillness of Body, Focus of thought, oneness of spirit. These are the virtues of a concer.

The only man to boycott happiness!

[EagleEyes]

I have seen fog my whole time playing HL. I could care less if you can see me underwater or not. I just don't like the underwater snipers that I can't see that kill me alot.
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[erba_knoff^]

I play With D3D and i doesnt have Fog....
I play with it cuz TFC run much better for me then. Im in SWE and ill whant my comp to run as "clear" as possible...
And Ofcourse a lil in cuz of the fog... I have Always Always play without it, so i will always do... :?
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Bah

[Violent Pacifist]

TFC messes up badly when I change to D3D, so I just stay with OpenGL and live with the fog
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We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of dreams.

[Bright Red Nipples]

I switched to D3D last night to try it out. My framerates dropped from 60 FPS in OpenGL to 21-25 FPS in D3D. I've always played in OpenGL and was just curious what all the hype was. I'll just have to suffer with the better graphics .

[Potato-VS-]

Fog? What fog? I have an 11MB Intel VC and I have no fog. All that it is is the distance from me to another spot underwater that is kinda fogs but I can see FINE!

[RS]Potato-VS-

[ToRaK]

Hey EE get on IRC you h0r.
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The most hated.

[Blown]

I play in opengl and have the fog, I hate it when you have a sniper or HW sitting at the other end, which you cant see till they start gunning you down cause thier view is CLEAR. If all opengl users can get rid of it then I guess it isnt that big of a deal.

[Snaggletooth]

I've got Nemesis...it rox0rs. It lets you see how fast you're going, tells you the flag status, and you can manage your mp3 collection while playing. Oh yeah, it makes the water clear too.

[OpTlk]

BRN, how do you find out what your fps is?? is it just by what the server says in console during startup or is there another way to check it.

i started playing with openGL and it was horrible on maps like well and rock2(could barely see the walls on the underwater well tunnels and the water on rock...forget it..if i went underwater i'd usually drown from pitch blackness)now im using D3D for the past month or so and vision has improved ten fold!, but i dont see it as anymore of an unfair advantage as say someone who has a better 'net connection then someone else. I mean, everyones computers are different and if your specs allow you to use d3d and still get good play...it shouldn't be seen as cheating...just something that makes the game more fun for you to play! its a feature available to anyone just like cable modems and 2 gig processors but still, i never really thought of it as a huge problem though...most maps are 10:1 ground over water anyways aren't they.
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http://www.myspace.com/pvallone

[Snaggletooth]

[Sully]

<-------- Has the fog.
<-------- Thinks it looks neato.
<-------- Doesn't care when people shoot him who don't have the fog.
<-------- Play's for fun.
<-------- W00t.



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Sig courtesy of K.R.G.

[Snaggletooth]