[Axa]

Pathetic
You cry like a baby when they are not there to put their lives on the line to put out a fire in your home probably caused by stupidity - and yet you moan when they ask for more money ????
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Axa


http://www.melenie.com
The Axacam® - Now more popular than pr0n

[bobins]

[Azrael]

[ROOFCUTTER]

I doubt they or anyone else thinks they are gonna get 40%.

The discussion has begun, 4% vs 40% somewhere in between they will

arrive at a number. I wonder if Tony Blair will survive this one. He is

under the gun and its been his decesions that slowed and prevented

negotation so far.

You said it yourself they have to work two jobs to make ends meet.

That sucks. Sometimes the push for what you want is painful.

The labor movement in this country was bloody and painful too.

But most of us live better and more comfortable today because of it.

Regardless if they are in the unions or a part of any particular industry.

Lets hope this is resolved now before they feel forced to walk again.

This is just an observation from my end. not a judgement on the morality

of walking.
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Only in America......do they have drive-up ATM machines with Braille lettering.

[Axa]

Well, err, I never thought expressing an opinion would elicit such a response. Namecalling really is unnescessary, isn't it ?
Further, I won't "shut the f**k up" as you so eloquently put it. If your underpaid firefighters reacted like you do, think how much trouble the negotiations would be in ?

I merely feel that the firefighters deserve to be heard. Let's face it - they would not be striking if all was peachy and fine. Someone with a little more knowledge and skill in wage negotiations than you was obviously denying them what is due to them. Strikes, negotiations and demands are a sanctioned process, which I feel are necessary for balance.

Bobins - while I appreciate the fact that you empathise with those affected by the strike, perhaps you could be a little more gentlemanly in your response. After all, we are all adults here, and I meant no trouble by my post.

Azrael - perhaps you would like to put more thought into your post before rushing off the deep end. Note Frag's post, and learn that there are always opinions that do not make you feel warm and fuzzy inside, and perhaps learn to deal with them more appropriately. There is also no call for you to be ashamed. Especially with all the sleep you must be losing due to the horrors of labor relations in Britain. I am all out of martyr badges, so you don't get one. Don't flatter yourself and think you speak on behalf of my morals and opinions.

Ugg, now see what you have done - got me all riled up and everything - see what a bit of namecalling does ????
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Axa


http://www.melenie.com
The Axacam® - Now more popular than pr0n

[BitterBeerFace]

<rant about the state of our western society>

You know, people who provide "public service" are vastly underpaid and underappreciated. Firefighters, police, emergency medical folks, teachers, garbage men (sanitation engineers), security folks, etc etc etc

These people are the ones who directly affect the lives of thousands, and yet get paid a pathetic pittance, since they don't generate a lot of incoming cash.

We used to think that airport security people were worthless folks... something finally happened and we realized that they are infact important.

Let's see what happens when the garbage men of New York go on strike for a month...

The UK has already seen what happens when the firemen go on strike.

I say pay 'em.

</rant>

That said, the firemen's strike is directly responsible for people's deaths. If Joe Public purposely prevented a fire engine from getting to a fire where someone dies who could have been saved, Joe Public would be fux0red. I say send in the army and seize the proper equipment--Then remind the firemen that people are actually burning alive, and it's their fault (threaten with criminal prosecution for anyone who interferes with the public safety)

At least that would put some pressure to negotiate something and get things back safer.

I hope it all works out well and fast.

[Azrael]

Axa, you are completely right, I was rash when I called you a name, and I apologize for that. But don't ever think that you qualify for giving out badges of any sort. No one in their right mind asks to be a martyr, in fact the only ones that I know of who do wear bombs on their chests, not badges.

That being said, I never tried to speak for your morals or opinions, those were all mine. I just have to wonder what type of person is able to calmly look at the deaths of innocent people (remember those children that died?), and say that the people who reacted as they did were pathetic. I wonder how pathetic we would be if our firefighters did the same as the ones in the UK. I wonder if you would be as pathetic if your loved ones died in a fire caused by stupidity. What would you do? would you look at them in the same light? Could they still be your heroes? What do you say to the children, "Yes Timmy, the firemen would be here to save us, but they're sitting a picket-line right now." While I can see that the UK firefighters are grossly underpaid, I can also see that they chose their calling. I refuse to believe that any firefighter does it for the money. And like Bitter BeerFace said ALL public service personnel are underpaid.

Does something need to be done? Undoubtedly. The need for protection services does not need to be stated again. However, these men took on a responsibility, they were responsible for safeguarding those children that died with their mother. Now they are responsible for their deaths.

Yes, sometimes getting what you want requires sacrifices, sometimes it requires the shedding of blood, but that blood should never come from children.

If American firefighters had done this, they would be on trial right now, or at least awaiting trial. They would not be showing up to work after a two day hiatus. I just wonder how many innocent lives their pay raise is worth.

Here's something else to consider; If they don't like what they're getting paid, they should find other employment. High turnover rates oftentimes help fuel pay raises where they are desparately needed. In the long run, the employers would be bankrupt if they had to train new firefighters every day.

I'll end the rant now.
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Under construction!!!

[Dahak]

henry clay frick?

[Azrael]

what, they need to be square to be hip (or something)?
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Under construction!!!

[FingerDemon]

Well I've got a lot of respect for the good that union actions have done over time, but I don't believe its right to strike in a situation like this. Especially since they could garner so much support by taking their cause to the media effectively. I mean everybody has been loving firefighters since 9/11. And I don't think thats just in New York.

Plus, what about the terrorist threat. So, now England is unprotected? What a opening for Al Qaeda. I appreciate working hard and not getting paid enough, but I think they had more options to exhaust to win their fight before blocking the doors of the firehouse.

My .02

<TVB>FingerDemon