need to pass your urine test?

Blown · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 1:08 pm Post subject:

I can see it passing for medical uses yes. For entertainment, personal enjoyment NO. For me personally MJ has a much stronger addiction than alcohol does. Point being mainly like someone else pointed out. Under MJ, you really have no sence of the day after like you do with Alcohol. That in itself would change the balance of how ppl go to parts go get thier social fix IMO. Instead of the drug of choice being alcohol, it would more likey change to MJ.

I also dont buy the part about MJ causing issues with the brain. I know a few ppl that all they have done in thier lives is smoke pot. I swear, they are ruined for life. They have zero ambition but to sit and smoke, they are total idiots to talk to. Maybe it would of been the same if they didnt smoke, I dunno but it sure doesnt look so good for them.

KopiKat · Registered User Joined: 15 May 2002 Posts: 923

Saying that there has been no deaths linked to the usage of marijuana is like saying that nobody has ever died from getting hit by a bus. Saying that his head was crushed under the wheel caused his death, may indeed be the truth, but if it werent for the bus hitting him, it never would have happened in the first place. They blame the death on high blood pressure, or vehicle accidents, but the fact remains that the marijuana is what CAUSED that problem in the first place. It is also a PROVEN fact that substances that alter your state of conciousness are an extreme hazard to driving. It may not be the pot that directly killed the person, but it's effects are what caused the death by other means. Marijuana slows down your reaction time, a proven fact, and anything that slows down reaction times and impairs coordination is a very dangerous thing to have in your body when you drive. This is just a fact, completely undisputable. Surveys, studies, and full scale research has proven this time and time again.

And for the record, Oregon approved "medical marijuana under the supervision of a doctor" for legal usage, but not actual marijuana.

-KK
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Blown · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 4:44 pm Post subject:

Mike · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 5:38 pm Post subject:

theres to many idiots in this world for it to be legal for personal use, if its medicinal, then it's fine. it would be worse then alcohol because you're not drunk after a couple of beers.
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R.I.P. Blue

Stevo · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 6:02 pm Post subject:

Lhiannan_Shee · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:17 pm Post subject:

Kahlan Amnell · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:45 pm Post subject:

Q: What are the short-term effects of marijuana use?
A: The short-term effects of marijuana include:

* problems with memory and learning; (1)
* distorted perception (sights, sounds, time, touch;(2)
* trouble with thinking and problemsolving; (3)
* loss of motor coordination; and
* increased heart rate.

These effects are even greater when other drugs are mixed with the marijuana; and for some people, marijuana raises blood pressure slightly and can double the normal heart rate.

Q: What are the long-term effects of marijuana use?
A: Findings so far show that regular use of marijuana or THC may play a role in some kinds of cancer and in problems with the respiratory and immune systems.

* Cancer
It’s hard to know for sure whether regular marijuana use causes cancer. But it is known that marijuana contains some of the same, and sometimes even more, of the cancer-causing chemicals found in tobacco smoke. Studies show that someone who smokes five joints per day may be taking in as many cancer-causing chemicals as someone who smokes a full pack of cigarettes every day. (4)

* Lungs and airways
Lungs and airways—People who smoke marijuana often develop the same kinds of breathing problems that cigarette smokers have: coughing and wheezing. They tend to have more chest colds than nonusers. They are also at greater risk of getting lung infections like pneumonia.

* Immune system
Animal studies have found that THC can damage the cells and tissues in the body that help protect against disease. When the immune cells are weakened you are more likely to get sick.

Q: How does marijuana affect driving?
A: Marijuana has serious harmful effects on the skills required to drive safely: alertness, the ability to concentrate, coordination, and the ability to react quickly. Marijuana use can make it difficult to judge distances and react to signals and sounds on the road.

Marijuana may play a role in car accidents. In one study conducted in Memphis, TN, researchers found that, of 150 reckless drivers who were tested for drugs at the arrest scene, 33 percent tested positive for marijuana, and 12 percent tested positive for both marijuana and cocaine(5). Data have also shown that while smoking marijuana, people show the same lack of coordination on standard "drunk driver" tests as do people who have had too much to drink[6].

A study of patients in a shock-trauma unit who had been in traffic accidents revealed that 15 percent of those who had been driving a car or motorcycle had been smoking marijuana, and another 17 percent had both THC and alcohol in their blood (7).

Q: How does marijuana affect the brain?
A: THC affects the nerve cells in the part of the brain where memories are formed. This makes it hard for the user to recall recent events (such as what happened a few minutes ago). It is hard to learn while high - a working short-term memory is required for learning and performing tasks that call for more than one or two steps.

Among a group of long-time heavy marijuana users in Costa Rica, researchers found that the people had great trouble when asked to recall a short list of words (a standard test of memory). People in that study group also found it very hard to focus their attention on the tests given to them (8 ).

As people age, they normally lose nerve cells in a region of the brain that is important for remembering events. Chronic exposure to THC may hasten the age-related loss of these nerve cells. In one study, researchers found that rats exposed to THC every day for 8 months (about 1/3 of their lifespan), showed a loss of brain cells comparable to rats that were twice their age. It is not known whether a similar effect occurs in humans. Researchers are still learning about the many ways that marijuana could affect the brain.

Q: Do marijuana users lose their motivation?
A: Some frequent, long-term marijuana users show signs of a lack of motivation (amotivational syndrome). Their problems include not caring about what happens in their lives, no desire to work regularly, fatigue, and a lack of concern about how they look. As a result of these symptoms, some users tend to perform poorly in school or at work. Scientists are still studying these problems.

Q: Can a person become addicted to marijuana?
A: Yes. While not everyone who uses marijuana becomes addicted, when a user begins to seek out and take the drug compulsively, that person is said to be dependent on the drug or addicted to it. In 1999, over 220,000 people entering drug treatment programs reported marijuana as their primary drug of abuse, showing they needed help to stop using (9).

Some heavy users of marijuana show signs of dependence because when they do not use the drug, they develop withdrawal symptoms. Some subjects in an experiment on marijuana withdrawal had symptoms, such as restlessness, loss of appetite, trouble sleeping, weight loss, and shaky hands.

According to one study, marijuana use by teenagers who have prior serious antisocial problems can quickly lead to dependence on the drug. That study also found that, for troubled teenagers using tobacco, alcohol, and marijuana, progression from their first use of marijuana to regular use was about as rapid as their progression to regular tobacco use, and more rapid than the progression to regular use of alcohol (10).

References: most of them
1. Pope, H. G. and Yurgelun-Todd, D. The Residual Cognitive Effects of Heavy Marijuana Use in College Students. Journal of the American Medical Association, Vol 275, No. 7, February 21, 1996.
2. Jones, R.T. et al. Clinical relevance of cannabis tolerance and dependence. Journal of Clinical Pharmacology, 21 (Suppl 1): 143-152,1981.
3. Harder. S. and Reitbrock, S. Concentration-effect relationship of delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol and prediction of psychotropic effects after smoking marijuana. International Journal of Clinical Pharmacology and Therapeutics, 35(4): 155-159, 1997.
4. Wu, T. C.; Tashkin, D. P.; Djahed, B.; and Rose, J.E. Pulmonary hazards of smoking marijuana as compared with tobacco. New England Journal of Medicine, 318: 347-351, 1988.
5. Brookoff, D.; Cook, C. S.; Williams, C.; and Mann, C. S. Testing reckless drivers for cocaine and marijuana. New England Journal of Medicine, 331:518-522, 1994.
6. Jones, R.T. et al. Clinical relevance of cannabis tolerance and dependence. Journal of Clinical Pharmacology, 21 (Suppl 1): 143-152,1981.
7. Soderstrom, C. A.; Dischinger, P. C.; Kerns, T. I.; and Trifillis, A. L. Marijuana and other drug use among automobile and motorcycle drivers treated at a trauma center. Accid. Anal. Prey. 25: 131-5, 1995
8. Fletcher. J. M.; Page. J. B.; Francis, D. J.; Copeland, K.; Naus, M. J.; Davis, C. M.; Morris, R.; Krauskopf. D.; and Satz. P. Cognitive correlates of long-term cannabis use in Costa Rican men. Arch. of General Psychiatry, 53: 1051-1057, 1996.
9. National Association of State Alcohol and Drug Abuse Directors, Inc., State Resources and Services Related to Alcohol and Other Drug Problems for Fiscal Year 1995: An Analysis of State Alcohol and Drug Abuse Profile Data, July 1997.
10. Crowley, T. J.; Macdonald, M. J.; Whitmore, E. A.; and Mikulich. S. K. Cannabis Dependence, Withdrawal, and Reinforcing Effects Among Adolescents With Conduct Symptoms and Substance Use Disorders. Drug and Alcohol Dependence, 1998.

there, that is my info. bet you know my stand on marijuana....

Yes, my references are paper ones not internet sites. I googled marijuana, and there are a lot of sites about marijuana... for marijuana... so. do some paper research too you guys. granted, most of the copyrights are late 90's, but I am sure there is more new information out there. plus most of these studies haven't been disproved, i say most because I don't know if any have, I haven't seen anything yet, but I leave that possibility open.
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http://ctprofiles.net/799963

5th GHG E.G. Mine · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 2:56 am Post subject:

Kahlan Amnell · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 2:59 am Post subject:

KopiKat · Registered User Joined: 15 May 2002 Posts: 923

My facts were posted in my second post on this thread:

Lhiannan_Shee · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:19 am Post subject:

First off, thank you for taking the time to post what you've come up for research, and your sources, Kahlan. Some of the sources you have quoted have been the same for my research... altho I will admit that the majority of what I have posted has been from things I have found online (the most reliable ones I could find, who have also listed references). At the Green Party headquarters there is a lot of information.... I work full time and am a relatively busy person so don't really have the time to compile a complete "report"... plus it seems the majority of people already have their minds made up on this subject. I will just comment on a few things though.

5th GHG E.G. Mine · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:20 am Post subject:

crackhead_fred · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:28 am Post subject:

Blown · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 12:22 pm Post subject:

KopiKat · Registered User Joined: 15 May 2002 Posts: 923

"The proof of the pudding is in the eating...."

The proof that marijuana is harmfull enough to be made illegal is inherent in the substance itself. Its' effects include many of those of both alchohol and cigarettes. It is a hazard to driving, if you dissagree, look at my previous post, all the information is there. It also causes lung cancer. Using a vaporizer, which eliminates the lung cancer, still doesn't address the fact that it does indeed impair your ability to drive. Now you, lhian, are a responsible user. I am not accusing you of anything. However, just as with alchohol, for every responsible user, there will be 10 irresponsible users. And those irresponsible users are the ones who are a danger to all of us on the road. Now, you have a valid point in thinking that it should be legal, because it's effects are similar to alcohol, which is legal. However, adding another substance like alcohol to the list of things that can be consumed legally is just asking for a vast increase in traffic fatalaties. If you feel comfortable in supporting an large increase in traffic fatalaties, fine and dandy, that's your decision and your opinion.

I do not feel comfortable supporting the legalization of another substance which impairs one's ability to drive. I drive alot, and i've seen an increasing number of impaired people on the roadway, and I do fear for my safety and for the safety of my family. If you do feel comfortable supporting the legalization of something that impairs the ability, then unfortunately we are just doomed to disagree.

With respect to medical marijuana, i have no problem with that, as long as it is used in medicine only. They put warnings on the sides of all pain killing medicines saying "do not drive or operate heavy machinery while under the influence of this drug," and i'm sure they would do the same for medicinal pot. It's no different in that respect to any other pain killer on the market, and i support it's use.

But remember, driving and using it is an extreme hazard to everyone on the roadway. If you disagree, my research is in my previous post.

-KK
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